516 lines
29 KiB
HTML
516 lines
29 KiB
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<h3>Recommendations</h3>
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<p><a href="/books/401-music-store-manager.html">Only Jesus</a> (great song by Big Daddy)</p>
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<p><a href="http://astore.amazon.com/jwoogm-20?node=1&page=2">What Did Jesus Say?</a> (2012) - 7 topics </p>
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<p>None above affiliated with me</p> </div>
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<h2>Salvation By Giving Birth to a Child</h2>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">One of the strangest statements by Paul is: </span></p>
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<p style="padding-left: 30px;"><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">"Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.“ (<a href="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20tim%202:15&version=KJV">1 Tm 2:15</a> KJV)</span></p>
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<p style="padding-left: 30px;"><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">"But she will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith, love and holiness with propriety." (<a href="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20tim%202:15&version=NIV">1 Tim 2:15</a> NIV)</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">As one Nigerian pastor puts it: "This is a most bizarre doctrine of salvation."</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">First, please notice that WORKS play a role in this method of salvation, thereby contradicting what Paul teaches elsewhere, <em>e.g.</em>, Eph. 2:8-9. So what happened to faith alone?</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">And this contradiction is not Paul simply affirming childbirth saves. Other numerous actions are required (whether from her or her children) -- "charity, and holiness with sobriety." </span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">Is there any escape from this reading? From admitting Paul contradicts himself? No.</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">The Greek verb <em>sothesetai</em> (“will be saved”) denotes “salvation” and not simply 'preservation.' The mention of charity, holiness and sobriety as other virtuous deeds make this clear. Payne agrees in context that this is speaking of "spiritual salvation," as it comes on the heals of Paul talking about the Fall. And Paul never uses the word "saved" for anything but spiritual salvation in every other use Paul employed in the NT. Paul used a different word when he meant physical preservation. See Philip Barton Payne, <em>Man and Woma</em><em>n: One in Christ</em> (Zondervan: 2009) at <a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=XS20RmXVDBcC&lpg=PA417&ots=u8In25iYPr&dq=paul%20salvation%20by%20childbirth&pg=PA418#v=onepage&q=paul%20salvation%20by%20childbirth&f=false">418</a>-422.</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">Second, the Greek says a woman is saved <em>dia tes teknogonias</em> (“through the childbirth”). Pretty unambiguous stuff. But some contend this means women are saved by means of the birth of Jesus. ("<a href="http://www.biblicalhorizons.com/biblical-horizons/no-134-how-are-women-saved/">How are women saved?</a>"; Payne, <em>id.</em>, at<a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=XS20RmXVDBcC&lpg=PA417&ots=u8In25iYPr&dq=paul%20salvation%20by%20childbirth&pg=PA422#v=onepage&q=paul%20salvation%20by%20childbirth&f=false"> 422</a>.) Yet, this does not fit the rest of the sentence, which again extols other acts of virtue that are necessary for salvation, whether by her or her children.</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">This passage is a true dilemma.</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">In my view, what it really says is that a woman is saved by childbirth if her children exhibit faith, charity and holiness with sobriety. For the subject is singular feminine with sothesetai -- "she will be saved" and then "childbirth" arises, and the subject changes to "they," implying the children she produces. Thus, Paul teaches a woman's salvation hinges upon the obedience of her children -- their faith, charity, holiness and sobriety.</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">Very strange stuff indeed for Paul who elsewhere teaches salvation is by faith alone! See Romans 3:4-5; Eph. 2:8-9. P.C. Spicq found this passage so "bizarre" he said Paul could not have uttered it. See Philip Barton Payne, <em>Man and Woma</em><em>n</em> (Zondervan: 2009) at <a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=XS20RmXVDBcC&lpg=PA417&ots=u8In25iYPr&dq=paul%20salvation%20by%20childbirth&pg=PA417#v=onepage&q=paul%20salvation%20by%20childbirth&f=false">417</a>.</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">Thus, Paulinists have a very strange hero -- self-contradictory and bizarre unless they edit him down to tolerable limits, or distort his words to avoid their plain meaning.</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;" data-mce-mark="1"></span></p>
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<hr />
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<p>NOTE: PAUL REPEATS THIS BIZARRE IDEA OF SALVATION BY FAMILY RELATIONSHIP + FAITH OF ONE</p>
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<p> </p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;" data-mce-mark="1">Paul's personal view of salvation similar to that in 1 Timothy is in line with 1 Corinthians 10:10-14. Paul will teach a child is saved by its mother or father's faith. (And the non-believing spouse is saved by the believing spouse's faith.) T</span><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;" data-mce-mark="1">he Disciples Literal New Testatment reads:</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;" data-mce-mark="1"></span></p>
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<h3 class="left-4" style="margin: 20px 0px 10px 64px; padding: 0px; line-height: 1.1; font-weight: 500; font-size: 1.55em; color: #000000; font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; position: relative;"><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10" style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">But Do Not Divorce Your Christian Spouse</span></h3>
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<p> </p>
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<p class="left-4" style="margin: 0px 0px 10px 64px; padding: 0px 0px 10px; color: #000000; font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; line-height: 24px; position: relative;"><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10" style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;"><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10"><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10">10 </span>But <em>to</em> the <em>ones</em> having married I command (not I, but the Lord),<em>that a</em> wife not be separated from <em>her</em> husband— </span><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10"><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10">11 </span>but if indeed she is separated, let her remain unmarried or let her be reconciled <em>to her</em>husband— and <em>that a</em> husband not leave<span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10">[<a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+corinthians+7%3A10-14&version=DLNT#fen-DLNT-5354a" style="color: #b34b2c; text-decoration: underline; cursor: pointer; vertical-align: top; background: transparent;" title="See footnote a">a</a>]</span> <em>his</em> wife.</span></span></p>
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<p> </p>
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<h3 class="left-4" style="margin: 20px 0px 10px 64px; padding: 0px; line-height: 1.1; font-weight: 500; font-size: 1.55em; color: #000000; font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; position: relative;"><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10" style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;">Do Not Divorce an Unbelieving Spouse Who Chooses To Stay</span></h3>
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<p> </p>
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<p class="left-4" style="margin: 0px 0px 10px 64px; padding: 0px 0px 10px; color: #000000; font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; line-height: 24px; position: relative;"><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10" style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;"><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10"><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10">12 </span>But <em>to</em> the rest <strong>I</strong> say, not<span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10">[<a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+corinthians+7%3A10-14&version=DLNT#fen-DLNT-5355b" style="color: #b34b2c; text-decoration: underline; cursor: pointer; vertical-align: top; background: transparent;" title="See footnote b">b</a>]</span> the Lord— if any brother has <em>an</em>unbelieving wife and this <em>one</em> consents to dwell with him, let him not leave her. </span><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10"><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10">13 </span>And if any woman has <em>an</em> unbelieving husband and this <em>one</em> consents to dwell with her, let her not leave <em>her</em> husband. </span><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10"><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10">14 </span>For the unbelieving husband has been <em><strong>sanctified</strong></em><span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10"><em><strong>[</strong></em><a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+corinthians+7%3A10-14&version=DLNT#fen-DLNT-5357c" style="color: #b34b2c; text-decoration: underline; cursor: pointer; vertical-align: top; background: transparent;" title="See footnote c">c</a>]</span> by <em>his</em> wife. And the unbelieving wife has been<strong><em> sanctified</em></strong> by the brother. <strong><em>Otherwise then your children are unclean, but now<span id="en-DLNT-5353" class="text 1Cor-7-10">[<a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+corinthians+7%3A10-14&version=DLNT#fen-DLNT-5357d" style="color: #b34b2c; text-decoration: underline; cursor: pointer; vertical-align: top; background: transparent;" title="See footnote d">d</a>]</span> they are holy</em></strong>. (<a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+corinthians+7%3A10-14&version=DLNT" style="color: #517291; text-decoration: underline;">1 Cor. 10:7-14 DLNT</a>.)</span></span></p>
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<p> </p>
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<p style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px 0px 10px; color: #494a44; font-family: Tahoma, Verdana, Geneva, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 21px;"><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;" data-mce-mark="1">Clearly, Paul is off again on the same theory as 1 Timothy that contradicts his faith-alone doctrine. Here, Paul ascribes the cleansing of a sin for one parent to not only automatically apply to their spouse but also to their children. See</span><a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+corinthians+7%3A10-14&version=DLNT" style="color: #517291; text-decoration: underline;">1 Cor. 7:10-14</a><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;" data-mce-mark="1">. Paul had the good sense not to attribute that idea to God that one's salvation is through close blood-relationships within a single family unit without faith. John the Baptist decried the same idea in Matthew chapter 1 -- the Jews who thought their relationship with Father Abraham saved them.</span></p>
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<p style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px 0px 10px; color: #494a44; font-family: Tahoma, Verdana, Geneva, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 21px;"><span style="font-size: large; font-family: 'times new roman', times;" data-mce-mark="1">But if you put this idea together with the idea about a mother being saved by her child's faith in 1 Tim. 2:15, the only way to reconcile both passages is that each person in the chain is sanctified by the other: the mother by the child's faith (1 Tim 2:15); the child by his mother's faith (1 Cor. 10:14); and the unbelieving spouse by the believing spouse's faith. (1 Cor. 10:12-14.) </span></p>
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