530 lines
28 KiB
HTML
530 lines
28 KiB
HTML
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<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd">
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<html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" xml:lang="en-gb" lang="en-gb" >
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<head>
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<base href="http://www.jesuswordsonly.com/Recommended-Reading/email-discussions.html" />
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<meta name="keywords" content="Jesus Words, Jesus Words Only, Jesus Words on Salvation, Did Calvin Murder Servetus, Flaws of Young Earth Science, Ingenious Design, Apostle Paul" />
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<meta name="author" content="DJD" />
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<meta name="description" content="Jesus Words Only focuses on the words of Jesus as the sole inspired portion of the New Testament Scripture" />
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<title>Email Discussions | Contact Us</title>
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MediaObject.init({'flash':"9,0,124,0",'windowmedia':"5,1,52,701",'quicktime':"6,0,2,0",'realmedia':"7,0,0,0",'shockwave':"8,5,1,0"});jQuery(document).ready(function(){jceutilities({'popup':{'legacy':0,'resize':1,'icons':1,'overlay':1,'overlayopacity':0.8,'overlaycolor':"#000000",'fadespeed':500,'scalespeed':500,'width':640,'height':480,'hideobjects':1,'scrollpopup':1,'theme':"standard",'themecustom':"",'themepath':"plugins/system/jceutilities/themes"},'tootlip':{'classname':"tooltip",'opacity':1,'speed':150,'position':"br",'offsets':"{'x': 16, 'y': 16}"},'imgpath':"plugins/system/jceutilities/img",'pngfix':0,'wmode':0});});
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<table class="contentpaneopen">
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<tr>
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<td valign="top" >"It is not in the epistles we learn the fundamentals. We shall find those necessary points best in the preaching of our Savior." (John Locke (1696).)</td>
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</table>
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</div>
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<h2><a href="http://www.jesuswordsonly.com/" title="Relevant">Relevant</a></h2>
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<h2>A Joomla! Template for the Rest of Us</h2>
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<ul class="menu"><li><a href="http://www.jesuswordsonly.com/"><span>Home</span></a></li><li class="haschild"><a href="/JWO/jesuswordsonly.html" class="haschild"><span>Books</span></a><ul><li class="haschild"><a href="/JWO/jesuswordsonly.html" class="child"><span>Jesus' Words Only</span></a><ul><li><a href="/JWO/jesus-words-only-amazon.html"><span>Purchase from Amazon.com</span></a></li></ul></li><li class="haschild"><a href="/JWOS/jesuswordssalvation.html" class="child"><span>Jesus' Words on Salvation</span></a><ul><li><a href="/JWOS/jesuswordsonsalvationamazon.html"><span>Purchase from Amazon.com</span></a></li></ul></li><li class="haschild"><a href="/Did-Calvin-Murder-Servetus/didcalvinmurderservetus.html" class="child"><span>Did Calvin Murder Servetus?</span></a><ul><li><a href="/Did-Calvin-Murder-Servetus/calvinfreebookonline.html"><span>Download e-Book</span></a></li><li><a href="/Did-Calvin-Murder-Servetus/didcalvinmurderservetusbackground.html"><span>Background Material</span></a></li><li><a href="/Did-Calvin-Murder-Servetus/didcalvinmurderservetusamazon.html"><span>Purchase from Amazon.com</span></a></li></ul></li><li class="haschild"><a href="/Bible/hownottostudythebible.html" class="child"><span>How Not to Study the Bible</span></a><ul><li><a href="/Bible/hownottostudythebible.html"><span>Download e-Book</span></a></li></ul></li><li class="haschild"><a href="/Young-Earth-Science/flawsofyoungearthscience.html" class="child"><span>Flaws of Young Earth Science</span></a><ul><li><a href="/Young-Earth-Science/flawsofyoungearthscience.html"><span>Download e-Book</span></a></li></ul></li><li><a href="/Young-Earth-Science/unintended-disservice-of-young-earth-science.html"><span>Unintended Disservice</span></a></li><li><a href="/Hebrew-Matthew/original-gospel-of-matthew-in-hebrew.html"><span>Original Gospel of Matthew</span></a></li></ul></li><li id="current" class="active"><a href="/Recommended-Reading/recommendedreading.html"><span>Further Reading</span></a></li><li><a href="/Audio/audio-messages.html"><span>Media</span></a></li><li><a href="/About-The-Author/about-the-author.html"><span>About The Author</span></a></li><li class="haschild"><a href="/Review.list/" class="haschild"><span>Reviews</span></a><ul><li><a href="/jwo-reviews.html"><span>Jesus Words Only</span></a></li><li><a href="/jwos-reviews.html"><span>Jesus Words on Salvation</span></a></li></ul></li><li><a href="/Contact-Us/contactus.html"><span>Contact Us</span></a></li><li><a href="http://astore.amazon.com/jwoogm-20"><span>Amazon Shop</span></a></li><li><a href="/Recommended-Reading/topical-index-of-this-website.html"><span>Topic Index</span></a></li></ul>
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</div>
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</div>
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<div id="mainbody">
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<div id="showcasetop"> </div>
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<table width="940" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" align="center">
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<tr>
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<td id="leftcol" valign="top" width="200">
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<div class="inside">
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<div class="moduleS1">
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<div>
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<div>
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<h3>Search</h3>
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<input name="searchword" id="mod_search_searchword" maxlength="20" alt="Search" class="inputboxS1" type="text" size="20" value="search..." onblur="if(this.value=='') this.value='search...';" onfocus="if(this.value=='search...') this.value='';" /> </div>
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<input type="hidden" name="task" value="search" />
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<input type="hidden" name="option" value="com_search" />
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<input type="hidden" name="Itemid" value="3" />
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</form> </div>
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</div>
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</div>
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</div>
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<div class="moduleS1">
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<div>
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<div>
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<div>
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<h3>Questions?</h3>
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Please enter your questions, and we will get back to you as soon as possible. As an anti-spam measure, we ask that you re-type the code you see in the box below, prior to clicking "Send Message"<br /><br />
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<form name="s5_quick_contact" method="post" action="">
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<input class="inputbox" id="namebox" onclick="s5_qc_clearname()" onfocus="s5_qc_clearname()" style="font-size:11px; font-family:arial; width:80%" type="text" value="Name..." name="name"></input><br />
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<input class="inputbox" id="emailbox" onclick="s5_qc_clearemail()" onfocus="s5_qc_clearemail()" style="font-size:11px; font-family:arial; width:80%" type="text" value="Email..." name="email"></input><br />
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<input class="inputbox" id="subjectbox" onclick="s5_qc_clearsubject()" onfocus="s5_qc_clearsubject()" style="font-size:11px; font-family:arial; width:80%" type="text" value="Subject..." name="subject"></input><br />
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<textarea id="messagebox" rows="" cols="" class="inputbox textarea" onclick="s5_qc_clearbody()" onfocus="s5_qc_clearbody()" style="font-size:11px; font-family:arial; overflow:auto;width:80%; height:55px" name="message">Your Message...</textarea><br />
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<input class="inputbox" id="spambox" onclick="s5_qc_clearspam()" onfocus="s5_qc_clearspam()" style="font-weight:bold; font-size:11px; font-family:arial; width:80%" type="text" value="Enter The Code 1677" name="verif_box"></input><br />
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<input id="email_address" type="hidden" value="" name="email_address"></input>
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<input class="button" type="button" onclick="s5_qc_submit()" value="Send Message" ></input>
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</form>
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<script language="javascript" type="text/javascript">
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// <![CDATA[
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var s5_qc_spam_text = document.getElementById("spambox").value;
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function s5_qc_clearbody() {
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if (document.getElementById("messagebox").value == "Your Message...") {
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document.getElementById("messagebox").value="";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("namebox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("namebox").value = "Name...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("emailbox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("emailbox").value = "Email...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("subjectbox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("subjectbox").value = "Subject...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("spambox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("spambox").value = s5_qc_spam_text;
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}
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}
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function s5_qc_clearname() {
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if (document.getElementById("namebox").value == "Name...") {
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document.getElementById("namebox").value="";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("messagebox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("messagebox").value = "Your Message...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("emailbox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("emailbox").value = "Email...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("subjectbox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("subjectbox").value = "Subject...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("spambox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("spambox").value = s5_qc_spam_text;
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}
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}
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function s5_qc_clearemail() {
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if (document.getElementById("emailbox").value == "Email...") {
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document.getElementById("emailbox").value="";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("namebox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("namebox").value = "Name...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("messagebox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("messagebox").value = "Your Message...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("subjectbox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("subjectbox").value = "Subject...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("spambox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("spambox").value = s5_qc_spam_text;
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}
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}
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function s5_qc_clearsubject() {
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if (document.getElementById("subjectbox").value == "Subject...") {
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document.getElementById("subjectbox").value="";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("namebox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("namebox").value = "Name...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("emailbox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("emailbox").value = "Email...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("messagebox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("messagebox").value = "Your Message...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("spambox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("spambox").value = s5_qc_spam_text;
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}
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}
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function s5_qc_clearspam() {
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if (document.getElementById("spambox").value == s5_qc_spam_text) {
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document.getElementById("spambox").value="";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("namebox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("namebox").value = "Name...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("emailbox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("emailbox").value = "Email...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("messagebox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("messagebox").value = "Your Message...";
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}
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if (document.getElementById("subjectbox").value.length < 1) {
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document.getElementById("subjectbox").value = "Subject...";
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}
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}
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function s5_qc_isValidEmail(str_email) {
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if (str_email.indexOf(".") > 2 && str_email.indexOf("@") > 0) {
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alert('Your email is now being submitted - Thank you!');
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|||
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document.s5_quick_contact.submit();
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}
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else {
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alert('Your email address is not valid, please check again - Thank you!');
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}
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|||
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}
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function s5_qc_submit() {
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if (document.getElementById("spambox").value == s5_qc_spam_text || document.getElementById("subjectbox").value == "Subject..." || document.getElementById("namebox").value == "Name..." || document.getElementById("emailbox").value == "Email..." || document.getElementById("messagebox").value == "Your Message...") {
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alert('All fields are required, please complete the form - Thank you!');
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return false;
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}
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if (document.getElementById("spambox").value != "1677") {
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alert('Your spam verification answer is incorrect.');
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return false;
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}
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var s5_message_holder = document.getElementById("messagebox").value;
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var s5_first_message_char = s5_message_holder.charAt(0);
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var s5_second_message_char = s5_message_holder.charAt(1);
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var s5_third_message_char = s5_message_holder.charAt(2);
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var s5_fourth_message_char = s5_message_holder.charAt(3);
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if (s5_first_message_char == "<") {
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return false;
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}
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if (s5_first_message_char == "w" && s5_second_message_char == "w" && s5_third_message_char == "w") {
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return false;
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}
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if (s5_first_message_char == "h" && s5_second_message_char == "t" && s5_third_message_char == "t") {
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return false;
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}
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if (s5_message_holder.indexOf("s5_qc_null") >= 0) {
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return false;
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<h3>Recommendations</h3>
|
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|
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<p><a href="/Audio/music-store-manager.html">Only Jesus</a> (great song by Big Daddy)</p>
|
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<p><a href="http://astore.amazon.com/justjesus0ece-20">Just Jesus: His Living Words (2011)</a></p>
|
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<p><a href="http://astore.amazon.com/jesusonchurchstructure-20">Jesus' Words on Church Structure</a> by S. Rives</p>
|
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<p><a href="http://www.jesusfocusedpublishers.com/"></a></p>
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<h2>Email Dialogues</h2>
|
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|
|
<p><a href="/Contact-Us/jesus-sent-to-israel-so-what-about-gentiles.html">J.</a> (August 14, 2012) - What About The Pre-Ascension Jesus Was Sent Only to Israel, not Gentiles?</p>
|
|||
|
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<p><a href="/Contact-Us/is-god-of-ot-different-than-nt.html">C. </a>(July 27, 2012) - How do I explain the God of the OT and NT appear different</p>
|
|||
|
|
<p><a href="/Contact-Us/email-do-we-really-have-to-suffer-persecution.html">C.</a> (July 15, 2012) - Do We Have to Really Endure Persecution and Isolation for these Views?</p>
|
|||
|
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<p><a href="/Contact-Us/does-paulamplify-or-garble-the-gospel.html">Jeff</a> (July 6, 2012) - Did Paul Only Amplify Jesus' Gospel as Jeff contends?</p>
|
|||
|
|
<p><a href="/Contact-Us/israel-a-wife-divorced-question.html">Cindi M. </a>(February 2012) - Can God remarry Israel after divorcing her and supposedly marrying another?</p>
|
|||
|
|
<p><a href="http://godsbreath.wordpress.com/2011/04/28/so-you-reject-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-13043">Scott Schifferd</a> (September 2011) - I answer his critique of affirming JWO as inspired canon -- after his blog article defending, posted at his web-blog. (This is posted in full below at end of this 'Dialogues' page for easier access.)</p>
|
|||
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<p><a href="/Contact-Us/tertullian-scope-of-quote.html">Eric</a> (December 25, 2010). Does the Tertullian quote I rely upon still apply if Acts is Considered</p>
|
|||
|
|
<p><a href="/Contact-Us/adams-questions.html">Adam</a> (Dec. 27, 2010). More questions Adam relays from a critic.</p>
|
|||
|
|
<p><a href="/Contact-Us/paul-and-barnabas-as-apostles-of-antioch.html">Adam</a> (December 24, 2010). What about fact Luke describes Paul and Barnabas as apostles in Acts 14:4?</p>
|
|||
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|
<p><a href="/Contact-Us/balaam-and-paul.html">Dr. PB</a> (December 20, 2010). A theologian tries to criticize JWO, but really reveals how Paulinists have no answer to JWO.</p>
|
|||
|
|
<p><a href="/Contact-Us/ananias-and-paul.html">Gary</a> (October 15, 2010). If Ananias says Jesus said Paul is chosen in Acts 9, does this prove Jesus said it?</p>
|
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<p><a href="/JWO/daves-email-how-do-trust-any-inspiration.html">Dave</a> (September 1, 2010). If Paul is not inspired, how do we know any other book in NT is inspired?</p>
|
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|
|
<p><a href="/JWO/jesus-v-paul-on-rapture.html">Ed</a> (August 25, 2010). Is Paul's version of the rapture of believers true?</p>
|
|||
|
|
<p><a href="/Contact-Us/humor.html">Daniel</a> (August 14, 2010). Daniel's humorous story about a Pastor who says Law has been fulfilled.</p>
|
|||
|
|
<p><a href="/JWO/jwo-aching-heart.html">Jennifer</a> (August 2, 2010). Why did God let this corruption of Scripture take place? Her heart aches for an answer.</p>
|
|||
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|
<p><a href="/JWO/email-acts-15-jwo.html">Walter</a> (June 9, 2010). Did Peter agree with Paul that the Law was a burden in Acts 15:9?</p>
|
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|
<p><a href="/Recommended-Reading/david-email-on-eye-for-an-eye.html">David</a> (June 8, 2010). Was Jesus's criticism of an eye for an eye a diminishment of the Law?</p>
|
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<p><a href="/JWO/law-applicable-today.html">Wheeler</a> (May 26, 2010). What Law applies today to Gentiles?</p>
|
|||
|
|
<p><a href="/JWO/victor-response.html">Victor</a> (January 2010) Victor disagrees that James' letter was for a trial. Also the reader can see in Victor's email the kind of personal invective and insult Paulinists use rather than reasoned argument.</p>
|
|||
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|
<p><a href="/JWO/chrish.html">Chris</a> (November 2008). A Christian who lost devotion, and was concerned that if Paul is false, would this make Jesus a failed messiah. My response exhorts Chris to try Jesus again with a new perspective on just Jesus.</p>
|
|||
|
|
<p><a href="/JWO/erica.html">Erica</a> (September 2007). Asks how I first came to realize Paul was false.</p>
|
|||
|
|
<p><a href="/Recommended-Reading/balaamlesson.html">Joe</a> (2006) Joe believes Paul's being chosen by Jesus makes it impossible to think Paul turned false later. The example of Balaam from the OT is used to refute that argument.</p>
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<p> </p>
|
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<hr />
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<p> </p>
|
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<p><a href="http://godsbreath.wordpress.com/2011/04/28/so-you-reject-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-13043">Posting 9-21-2011</a> at Scott Schiffred's Blog:</p>
|
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<p><span> </span></p>
|
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<p>This is the author of Jesus’ Words Only. If you read my book, you unfortunately skimmed over the preface which led you to wrongly interpret that I have a Reform and Baptist perception that we cannot fall from Grace. To the contrary, it was because I realized the error of the Reformed and Baptist positions on those issues in light of Jesus’ words in many places, e.g., Mark 9:42-47, that I rejected these Reformed / Baptist doctrine. But in the Preface I explain that then I had to deal with the fact that Paul gives contradictory lessons that do affirm eternal security and unalterable perservance. (You are right that Paul speaks of falling from grace, but (a) that proves a contradiction with his Eternal Security verses; or (b) is explained away by his Reformed / Baptist admirers.)</p>
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<p>So I agree with you that ES / Perseverance doctrine is wrong-but I do so because it contradicts Jesus. Which led me to ask the question: did Jesus ever call Paul an apostle, and thus we are bound to follow Paul who I could no refute says salvation is without works in Romans 4:3-5? And we shall be saved if we ever once (aorist tense) call on the name of the Lord and believe Jesus resurrected? (Romans 10:9.) The answer is no, Jesus never called Paul an apostle. In the 3 accounts of Paul’s encounter with the light-and-voice (Acts 9, 22, and 26) that said “I am Jesus,” the light-and-voice said Paul would be a MARTUS — Greek for witness. Not “apostolos” – which means messenger. And Jesus did not make James an apostle either, as you contend. Rather, that was Paul misunderstanding that James was an apostle; James was not. (In Galatians 2.) Jesus said there was only 12 apostles — Rev. 21 — into eternity who sit as the 12 judges over the 12 tribes. So the idea of adding a 13th (after the 11 unanimously chose Matthias to replace Judas in Acts ch. 1) is contradictory of JESUS.</p>
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<p>Thus, in fact, as the preface to Jesus Words Only points out, my problems with Reformed theology / Baptist eternal security, etc., are what led me to question Paul’s authority. So you have completely misunderstand where I am coming from and why. Please read the preface — free at <a href="http://www.jesuswordsonly.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.jesuswordsonly.com</a> — and look at “books” tab.</p>
|
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<p>And my position on Paul is consistent with (a) the early reformation — Carlstadt (see my site) – who co-led the Reformation with Luther in 1517 — who wrote in 1520 that Jesus has priority over Paul in formulating doctrine. (Luther disagreed and kicked out his partner); (b) the early church prior to 300 — Tertullian’s work of 207 AD Against Marcion saying Paul’s claim to being an apostle is self-serving and dubious; and (c) most importantly, by Jesus.</p>
|
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<p>Let’s look at what Jesus clearly says about Paul for those who have ears to hear. I found this only recently so you will have to read my website to find it. In Matt 5:17-19 Jesus says those in the kingdom of heaven will call the one who loosens the Law and teaches others not to follow the Law the “Least Man” — elicithos anthropous. (Those who teach to the contrary, Jesus calls the greatest in the kingdom.) Did you know Paul’s name — transliterated into Greek as Paulos from the Latin Paulus — is a shortened version (like Joe is for Joseph) of the name Pauxilus. And Paul’s true name of Pauxilus in Latin means, per Jamison Faucett, Augustine and other scholars cited at the page following — “LEAST.” Yes, that means Jesus warns us about Paul, saying for eternity the one who teaches to loosen the Law and tells us not to obey it will be called by those in heaven “THE LEAST MAN.” It was a prophecy. And in context of 5:17-20, it is a condemnation, not a praise.</p>
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<p>So I ask: will we follow Jesus or Paul? Their messages are not only not the same, but they also oppose each other. Paul does so mostly in a self-contradictory way so you can find some things that agree with your anti-ES / Perseverance doctrine and in agreement with Jesus, but if you are being honest, there are a host of contrary verses that support ES / Perseverance.</p>
|
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<p>So I did not come to this position because held Reformed or Baptist views, as you contend. Rather, I had to give those views up to follow Jesus, and face condemnation and attacks (I am sure they are meant in love by well-meaning brothers and sisters). I like most Christians of the dominant Pauline persuasion loved the easy way, the no-works gospel with no damnation for sin! Who would not wish that was the true Gospel? But alas, Jesus says you go to heaven “maimed” or hell “whole.” (Mark 9:42-47.) There is no other ‘way’ but Jesus’ way. Paul offers a dangerous alternative that comes up by different path — a non-apostolic path. Hence, we each have a decision — whether we will be loyal to Jesus’ or Paul’s gospel. I choose Jesus, and I hope you will do so too. Jesus is the Way, the Truth and the Life. Modern Christianity has turned that into a trite saying but it contains an important direction from our Lord. So here below is the link to the “Least Man” discussion. God bless. D<br /><a href="/JWO/jesus-on-paul-the-least.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.jesuswordsonly.com/JWO/jesus-on-paul-the-least.html</a></p>
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var pageTracker = _gat._getTracker("UA-3747914");
|
|||
|
|
pageTracker._initData();
|
|||
|
|
pageTracker._trackPageview();
|
|||
|
|
} catch(err) {}
|
|||
|
|
</script>
|
|||
|
|
</div>
|
|||
|
|
<div class="copyright"></div>
|
|||
|
|
</div>
|
|||
|
|
</body>
|
|||
|
|
</html>
|